words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/15/2012 00:01 (#2012-3829)

11 messages included in this issue
1My Opinionvegas3753@yahoo.com
2My Opinionjulesbrenner_rn@yahoo.com
3Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brotheryasdaz17@fastmail.fm
4words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826)yasdaz17@fastmail.fm
5Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brotheryasdaz17@fastmail.fm
6My Opinionmichellegibson88@hotmail.co.uk
7Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brother http://roxboroghreport.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-barry-gibb-interview-full.htmlyasdaz17@fastmail.fm
8My Opiniondiannaj1962@yahoo.com
9words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826)diannaj1962@yahoo.com
10words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826)brennan@columbia.edu
11words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826)jas92953@hotmail.com
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:16:40 -0800 (PST) From: Cindy <vegas3753@yahoo.com> Subject: My Opinion First off I do not think that you know me well enough to call me a hater.=A0 I have over 40 years of love for the music of the Bee Gees invested, so therefore I obviously do not hate them or any one of them.=A0 So therefore you do not have to "leave Cindy Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 19:25:10 -0500 From: Julie Brenner <julesbrenner_rn@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: My Opinion People get a grip. Leave these people alone. They went through struggles like everyone else. If you have nothing good to say then do not comment. Let Barry his family live in peace for they are probably beating themselves up over their own thoughts and co Their music gave me my start in my music and wish I could thank them. But I will remember the good things and let the rest go. So all of you should do the same thing! Grow up.... Jules On Dec 14, 2012, at 7:16 PM, Cindy wrote: > First off I do not think that you know me well enough to call me a hater. I have over 40 years of love for the music of the Bee Gees invested, so therefore I obviously do not hate them or any one of them. So therefore you do not have to "leave Cindy a >=20 >=20 > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com=20 >=20 > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:40:31 -0800 From: Yasmine Ghulamali <yasdaz17@fastmail.fm> Subject: Re: Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brother Thanks, Kate, for your opinions. Obviously I was never privy to the inner workings of Robin's life and maybe you are right that he had that much trouble coping with life. If that was the case, then certainly it would have been Molly and then Dwina who would be most "in charge" of the day to day, nitty gritty aspects of life. I can't imagine anyone else who would be taking responsibility. I just keep thinking that, even if it is true, it is a neat way to evade responsibility. I don't mean deliberately, nor that the wives (or whomever) took advantage (not privy to that much detail, lol!), but the bottom line is still a very problematic picture of an adult (albeit an artist) who did not (could not?) take control of his life. If that is the case, I am surprised that he managed as well as he seemed to in terms of husbanding his money, not going off the rails emotionally (at least not publicly), etc.... Well, unless someone in the "inner circle" manages to pen a "tell all" I guess we shall never know much (boy would I love, love to hear something from Molly about what he must have been like when she knew him). Would make sense of what glimpses we have gotten over the years about him being in trouble in the late 70's, his amphetamine use and emotional state after the divorce, I guess. Yasmine On 12/14/2012 12:54 PM, Kate wrote: > Hello Yasmine, > >> at least they >> seemed to be able to pull it together publicly for the funeral. > But judging from the graveside pictures, there was very little > interaction between two parties. > >> See, whenever I heard Barry say it was about the people around >> Robin, I figured he was either lying to not make the situation worse by >> directly nailing Robin or was in denial because who was it that chose >> those people in the first place? I mean I have not heard of Robin >> easily being taken advantage of in general, which is Barry's >> implication. > I myself feel otherwise. Robin clearly had trouble coping with > the practical aspects of life. And IMO a lot of troubles in his > life stemmed from this inability of his. I think it was a > double-edged sword. It kept him the artist he was, but it made > him very vulnerable in many ways. > > Kate > > > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com > > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. > Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:49:35 -0800 From: Yasmine Ghulamali <yasdaz17@fastmail.fm> Subject: Re: words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826) I remember that interview where Dwina said something about them not talking about how serious his situation was; I got the impression it was sort of a tacit agreement between them (and maybe his children too) not to talk about it. I guess I can understand at the very least trying to remain upbeat and positive although I am not sure where the line between that and having your head in the sand is. I don't know, that part of it is still mystifying to me. If I had the type of relationship Barry and Robin had over so many years, good and bad, I would try to find some closure with my sibling/bandmate, some form of reconciliation for lack of a better term. I know that sometimes that just is not possible, for various reasons. It just seems sad to me that in this case, for whatever reasons, no attempt was even made (by what little we know). Yasmine On 12/14/2012 1:00 PM, Kate wrote: > Barbara was over in England for Christmas last year and helped > Robin to cope with the last major chemotherapy he had to go > through, I think. > > But whether Barbara and Barry and also Robin were actually kept > abreast of the exact nature or state of his illness, I am not > really sure. From what Dwina has said in one of her recent > interviews, I got the impression that Robin did not know. At > least he was never told. And from what Barry has said, it seems > he did not know, either. > > Kate > > > "Toni Quintana" wrote: > >> "I fully believe that Barry and Barbara were kept out of the loop as to >> Robins health no doubt in my mind. If they had known they would have gone to >> England staright away to see what they could have done to help" >> >> If I remember well there is a photo of Barry and Linda in The ^Rebendal last >> Christmas, they went to visit to visit Robin, so Barry Knew about the health >> issues. For Barbara..., I can understand if Robin had not said a word to >> her. >> >> Toni. >> >> >> >> "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) >> http://www.brothersgibb.com >> >> To change any of your list options, >> please go to website listed above. > > > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com > > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. > Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:54:54 -0800 From: Yasmine Ghulamali <yasdaz17@fastmail.fm> Subject: Re: Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brother Yikes! Wow, now that really sounds strange. Huh?? Not even in control over your own phone? If this was the case, I wonder why the different numbers (security maybe?)? If this was the case, I can completely understand people having trouble reaching him. Did he ever say who gave him these numbers? I wonder what happened with Spencer and Melissa; if they had problems reaching him? More questions but more possible pieces of the puzzle as well, Yasmine On 12/14/2012 1:05 PM, Kate wrote: > Hello Yasmine, > > I don't think there was a direct number where Robin could be > reached. I understand he had his mobile phone, but that too was > very often not administered by him. Robin once told me that they > had a very strange system where he was given different numbers > at different times and in those cases he didn't know his own > number. > > Over the years I've heard many people complain about > this difficulty of reaching Robin, especially in the last months > because at that time very understandably Robin was not in > control of anything. So I think it quite possible that > even Barry had a communication problem. > > Best, > > Kate > > > Yasmine Ghulamali wrote: > >> Okay, I have to ask, why would Barry not have a number to reach Robin >> directly? Now, if he did and Robin did not reply, that is one thing but >> not having his direct number seems a bit odd to me (not knowing how >> these high flying celebrities organize their lives, lol!). Again, if >> Barry could not get through Robin's advisers, that is ultimately Robin's >> fault for not giving him what he should have had in the beginning, which >> is a direct way to reach him. And yes, there were various points, >> including when Robin's diagnosis was first officially confirmed, when >> Barry flew over, if only for a little while (not sure why he never >> stayed more than a couple of days, it seems, but anyway...) from what I >> remember. So it is not as if he did not get the chance to at least >> snatch a couple of minutes with Robin to at least ask if he had gotten >> his messages, etc... but I am not sure what happened about their >> communication during those visits; perhaps there was too much to work >> through to even try? I agree he seems to be trying to work through a >> lot of confusion and hurt and I am sorry for him, it must be very hard, >> to say the least. However, I, for one, don't need to hear Barry's >> opinion except as expressed as an opinion, not as fact. To me that has >> been the problem with at least some of Barry's recent comments. I still >> understand that he is going through something I could not begin to >> fathom and I feel for him. It is the worst when you can't resolve >> issues because of death; it is hard to get closure. Yasmine >> On 12/13/2012 9:01 PM, DIANNA JOHNSON wrote: >>> It seems that Barry did try to contact Robin as he had said and he wasn't given a call back. I have to wonder if Robin even had recieved those messsages that Barry had called him. I fully believe that Barry and Barbara were kept out of the loop as to >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: "Compoccias@aol.com" >>> To: words List Member >>> Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:41 PM >>> Subject: [words] Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brother >>> >>>> In a message dated 12/12/2012 3:56:45 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >>> myka@qdots.net writes: >>> >>>> Hello Sal, >>>>> I hate to say it, but the more he comments on Robin the less he sounds >>> like a >>>>> grieving brother and more like someone who is unloading bottled up >>> emotions >>>>> and opinions. >>>> But I think "to unload bottled up emotions and opinions" would >>>> be exactly what a grieving brother would do if he lost his >>>> brother with whom he had had a complex relationship (as in the >>>> case of Barry with Robin) AND communication problem. It seems he >>>> is trying to speculate a lot, trying to come to terms with >>>> things now that he can no longer ask the brother. >>>> Best, >>>> Kate >>> Yes. Quite true Kate. Yet it still remains a bit of a mystery as to what >>> happened between Barry & Robin in those last months (years). >>> >>> Sal >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) >>> http://www.brothersgibb.com >>> >>> To change any of your list options, >>> please go to website listed above. >>> >>> >>> "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) >>> http://www.brothersgibb.com >>> >>> To change any of your list options, >>> please go to website listed above. >> >> >> "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) >> http://www.brothersgibb.com >> >> To change any of your list options, >> please go to website listed above. > > > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com > > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. > Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 00:59:13 +0000 From: Michelle Gibson <michellegibson88@hotmail.co.uk> Subject: RE: My Opinion I completely agree, it is your opinion and it's your right to express it. I also don't think you are a "hater". I only said "leaving Cindy aside" in my response to Yakima because I wanted to focus on the messages going to the list as a whole, rather than > Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:16:40 -0800 > From: vegas3753@yahoo.com > Subject: [words] My Opinion > To: words@brothersgibb.com >=20 > First off I do not think that you know me well enough to call me a hater. I have over 40 years of love for the music of the Bee Gees invested, so therefore I obviously do not hate them or any one of them. So therefore you do not have to "leave Cindy a >=20 >=20 > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com=20 >=20 > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. =20 Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 17:01:59 -0800 From: Yasmine Ghulamali <yasdaz17@fastmail.fm> Subject: Re: Last Bee Gee reveals rift with brother http://roxboroghreport.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-barry-gibb-interview-full.html Thanks for going back, Timeless. (Okay, I can't help myself; are you=20 going back in time? Very bad, I know, roll eyes). I remember being=20 intrigued by those comments myself (sorry I did not post about it at the=20 time). Certainly Barry's comments about being the older brother rings=20 true. Although his comments over the years have not indicated any=20 problem with that role, indeed there are several articles from the late=20 '70's where he positively seems to relish it! I have said this before=20 but in family systems therapy, once you are assigned a "role" in the=20 family, in childhood, it is very difficult to break out of it, for=20 better or worse. He was always going to have the role of protective=20 older brother because a. that was the role he started out playing by=20 virtue of his birth order (witness comments (I think by Barry, maybe=20 Barbara) saying that Lesley bossed Barry about and took him under her=20 wing by virtue of being older than him) and b. later, I think, by=20 temperament and inclination. I think when someone feels like they "have=20 been left holding the can", as it were, especially over a long period of=20 time, there is a double dynamic going on. First, the can holder picks=20 up the can; s/he does not have to (in this case, was there not a=20 business manager they could have hired, for example?). Second, the can=20 dropper drops it because s/he knows it will be picked up. I believe=20 that often when therapists are faced with this situation, they advise=20 the can holder to deliberately not hold the can, to see if it will be=20 picked up; often it is (there was a whole chapter about this in one of=20 the "dances with ...." psychology series). Having said all that, yes I=20 can see that at least at times it must have been very hard for Barry to=20 carry all that weight; it also sounds like there were at least times=20 when M&R wanted to pick up that weight ("...over the years, (they) did=20 not like that [Barry being the older brother and carrying the=20 responsibilities he did] very much"). And yes, of course, in the=20 process of acquiring wives (and growing up into adults) of course it was=20 now very different than when they were children. All siblings that grow=20 up together must go through that dynamic, I think; a bit of separation=20 and loss of the day to day closeness that they used to have. However, I=20 can easily see that process not ever being completed by virtue of the=20 three brothers not only working together, but having such a psychic=20 closeness as part of that working relationship. It seems to have been=20 completed between the brothers and their sister. It was an impossible=20 situation in that sense ("They found they could never leave home",=20 Timothy White, This Is Where I Come In, the bio). Yasmine On 12/14/2012 7:50 AM, Judith Farrar wrote: > I went back and found the transcripts for Barry's interview in New Zealand a couple months ago. What I found interesting is Barry's reference to conflicts arising even as they were young- "BARRY: Well, I=92ve been the older brother and I=92ve lived the > Then he makes reference to the band conflicts that arose after everyone was married- " BARRY: The conflicts for us came much later on and mainly because of advisors. Mainly because in the early days we were just one family, just one family. You know, M > I hope the cut and past can be read. Here is the entire interview: http://roxboroghreport.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-barry-gibb-interview-full.html > Timelessbeegees > > > IIThen he references the conflicts that arose after all the brothers got married- > > =09 > > > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com > > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 17:21:57 -0800 From: diannaj1962 <diannaj1962@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: My Opinion ----_com.android.email_85144561798210-- Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 17:32:20 -0800 From: diannaj1962 <diannaj1962@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826) ----_com.android.email_91356557814670-- Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:57:32 -0500 From: Joseph Brennan <brennan@columbia.edu> Subject: Re: words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826) Cindy wrote: > Funny.....I see Barry as a self-centered jerk, myself.=A0 He strikes me as > one who thinks that if you don't do as I say or think as I say, then I > want nothing to do with you.=A0 This pattern has repeated itself often > throughout their career. I think this is fair. And yet also, I think Judy posted a great quote about Barry feeling an obligation to carry the weight for his younger brothers. He seems annoyed that people don't recognize how much he did for them. He acts as if he gave up a possible solo career to keep the family business going. Robin gets to record solo albums and do solo shows while he can't. Jealousy. And yet, he did work solo in the 1980s as a producer, and it seems to me he was the one who revived the Bee Gees when his own career faltered. And Robin was the one who wanted to revive the Bee Gees in the 2000s and got nothing back from Barry. Human beings are amazingly complicated creatures, and figuring them out is a very complex task. Yes, Barry sometimes acts as a self centered jerk. Yes he did. Cindy is right. But that is not the whole story. Joe Brennan Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 18:51:47 -0800 From: Judith Farrar <jas92953@hotmail.com> Subject: RE: words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/14/2012 06:01 (#2012-3826) Two thumbs up for Joe!!! Timelessbeegees >=20 > I think this is fair. And yet also, I think Judy posted a great quote > about Barry feeling an obligation to carry the weight for his younger > brothers. He seems annoyed that people don't recognize how much he did > for them. He acts as if he gave up a possible solo career to keep the > family business going. Robin gets to record solo albums and do solo > shows while he can't. Jealousy. And yet, he did work solo in the 1980s > as a producer, and it seems to me he was the one who revived the Bee Gees > when his own career faltered. And Robin was the one who wanted to revive > the Bee Gees in the 2000s and got nothing back from Barry. >=20 > Human beings are amazingly complicated creatures, and figuring them out > is a very complex task. Yes, Barry sometimes acts as a self centered > jerk. Yes he did. Cindy is right. But that is not the whole story. >=20 > Joe Brennan >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > "Words & Music", Fans Of The Brothers Gibb ( Bee Gees ) > http://www.brothersgibb.com=20 >=20 > To change any of your list options, > please go to website listed above. >=20 =20 End words@brothersgibb.com message digest 12/15/2012 00:01 (#2012-3829)